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Posted: 12/6/2023 3:21:21 AM EST
[#1]
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Posted: 12/6/2023 3:26:51 AM EST
[#2]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By AlmightyTallest:
Shoot the SAR aircraft down too. Make it hurt 
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Posted: 12/6/2023 3:28:04 AM EST
[#3]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By AlmightyTallest:
When I say that the South Koreans have come from a top ten military industrial complex to a top 5 or even 3 I wasn't making it on blind assumptions. They've made huge sales recently with Poland, too. |
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Posted: 12/6/2023 3:28:45 AM EST
[#4]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Prime: They had implied that they would be protecting Odesa better. I wouldn’t be surprised if Odesa had its own Patriot. @prime Germany is supposed to have delivered several more IRIS T systems and a Patriot soon and nobody knows where the SAMP T went
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Posted: 12/6/2023 3:31:08 AM EST
[#5]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By yekimak: Zelensky was supposed to give a speech to congress today. The vote on Aid to Ukraine is going on today too. |
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Posted: 12/6/2023 3:41:45 AM EST
[#6]
Why would they bother looking? No one ever survives PATRIOT hitting their aircraft. Never.
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NV, USA
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Posted: 12/6/2023 4:16:30 AM EST
[#7]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By RockNwood: Slovakia…another small country suckling on the Russian oil teat. Man, Europe went all in with cheap Russian oil and gas and then blathers about climate change and clean energy. What could possibly go wrong becoming totally dependent on Russia for keeping your factories running and the cash registers on??!! I’m am continually amazed Eastern Europe countries that suffered under Soviet attack and oppression jumped so easily into the lap of the tsar. I’ve seen street interviews asking similar question and the response is “It wasn’t so bad, we had lights and 2-3 meals a day. It could’ve been worse.”
To be fair, the US stayed but buddies with Saudi Arabia despite them being the real braintrust for international jihad through their network of religious indoctrination schools and financial backing to jihadists, even after 9/11. Oil is something no society can do without, and the majority of it is produced by really repugnant countries. |
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Posted: 12/6/2023 4:34:58 AM EST
[#8]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By fadedsun: Germany is supposed to have delivered several more IRIS T systems and a Patriot soon and nobody knows where the SAMP T went Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By fadedsun: Originally Posted By Prime: They had implied that they would be protecting Odesa better. I wouldn’t be surprised if Odesa had its own Patriot. Germany is supposed to have delivered several more IRIS T systems and a Patriot soon and nobody knows where the SAMP T went I wonder if Germany will get back the second system in Spring 2024. 
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NV, USA
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Posted: 12/6/2023 4:39:34 AM EST
[#9]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By fadedsun: When I say that the South Koreans have come from a top ten military industrial complex to a top 5 or even 3 I wasn't making it on blind assumptions. They've made huge sales recently with Poland, too. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By fadedsun: Originally Posted By AlmightyTallest:
When I say that the South Koreans have come from a top ten military industrial complex to a top 5 or even 3 I wasn't making it on blind assumptions. They've made huge sales recently with Poland, too. [b]Insight: Inside South Korea's race to become one of the world’s biggest arms dealers https://www.reuters.com/business/aerospace-defense/inside-south-koreas-race-become-one-worlds-biggest-arms-dealers-2023-05-29/ SEOUL, May 29 (Reuters) - South Korea is using a $13.7 billion arms deal with Poland - Seoul's biggest ever - to lay the groundwork for a military-industrial juggernaut that the two nations' defence companies hope will feed Europe's hunger for weapons far into the future. South Korea's arms sales jumped to more than $17 billion in 2022 from $7.25 billion the year before, according to its defence ministry, as Western countries scrambled to arm Ukraine and tensions rose in other hot spots such as North Korea and the South China Sea. South Korean and Polish officials say their partnership will help them conquer the European arms market even beyond the Ukraine war, with Seoul providing high-quality weapons faster than other countries and Poland offering manufacturing capacity and a sales pipeline into Europe. ... Hanwha Aerospace already had a 55% share of the global howitzer market - a number that will rise to an estimated 68% with the Poland deal, according to research by NH Research & Securities. At a Hanwha Aerospace factory on South Korea's southern coast, six huge automated robots and more than 150 production workers are churning out 47-ton K9s destined for Poland. The self-propelled guns use NATO-standard 155mm ammunition, have computerised fire-control systems, are designed to easily integrate into command and control networks, and offer performance comparable to more expensive Western options. Major powers such as Australia and India operate them. To meet demand, the company expects to add about 50 more workers and more production lines, production manager Cha Yong-su said during a recent tour. The robots handle about 70% of the welding work on a K9 and are key to expanding capacity, he said. They operate an average of eight hours per day but can work around the clock if needed. "Basically, we can meet any amount of order you want," Cha said. South Korea’s offer to provide weapons faster than almost anyone was a key consideration, Polish officials say. The first shipment of 10 K2s and 24 K9s arrived in Poland in December, just months after the deals were signed, and at least five more tanks and 12 additional howitzers have been delivered since. By contrast, Germany, another major arms manufacturer, has yet to deliver any of the 44 new Leopard tanks Hungary ordered in 2018, said Oskar Pietrewicz, senior analyst at the Polish Institute of International Affairs. "Countries' interest in South Korea's offer may only grow considering the limited production capacity of Germany's defence industry, which is a major arms supplier in the region," he said. A close relationship between South Korea's military and its arms industry allows them to rearrange domestic orders to make room for export production and expand production in the country's highly industrialized manufacturing base, officials said. "They put things together in weeks or months that would take us years," a European defence industry executive said, speaking on condition of anonymity because of the sensitivity of the matter. Constant tensions with North Korea mean the South's military production lines are running and its weapons have been developed, tested, and upgraded in high-pressure situations, said Cho Woorae, global business and strategy vice president at Korea Aerospace Industries. In the past year, South Korea has launched its first home-grown space rocket, saw the maiden flight of its domestically designed KFX fighter, and announced billions of dollars in deals. "For most other countries, that would be an agenda for a decade," one executive at a European defence firm told Reuters, speaking anonymously because of the sensitivity of the matter. "We’ve underestimated Korea for a long time."[/b] https://thediplomat.com/2023/07/is-south-korea-ready-to-be-a-global-pivotal-arms-exporter/ SK's goal is to be the #4 global weapons exporter by 2027. |
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Posted: 12/6/2023 4:40:36 AM EST
[#10]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By AlmightyTallest:
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GAgwThIXUAIXTsm?format=jpg&name=large Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By AlmightyTallest:
the frozen ground The video shows that the fight is ongoing in the forest. Rumors that the Russians want to achieve something by mid December when Putin will hold a large press conference. https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GAgwThIXUAIXTsm?format=jpg&name=large Bakraktars may be back in the south because Patriot is in Odesa now. Most likely Russian AC have had free reign over the coast. |
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Posted: 12/6/2023 4:58:48 AM EST
[#11]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By SoCalExile: Looks like the Russians have figured out the wunderwaffen called pallets: https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GAgMmAXWgAAJSH_?format=jpg&name=900x900
I think those are 200s - zinc coffins in their outer wooden case. |
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Posted: 12/6/2023 5:24:12 AM EST
[#12]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By RockNwood: Russia upholding family values no one else dares to: VIDEO!
I’m surprised they didn’t have a big screen playing videos of trench spanking and stick beatings in the background for suitable ambience. Overall that was kinda disturbing. But I did see a couple of cuties. |
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Posted: 12/6/2023 5:38:18 AM EST
[#13]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By AlmightyTallest:
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GAcqDFOX0AAWdre?format=png&name=small Video.
Oh shit that was awesome! |
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Posted: 12/6/2023 5:55:56 AM EST
[#14]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By ITCHY-FINGER: Excellent analysis. My one point of disagreement is that I dont think Orban wants to be a dictator or power broker. I think he is stuck in that Putin's plan did not work out but Orban cannot back out now since Putin may reveal details of certain promises made between them. Putin also needs Orban to preach Putin's aspirations and warnings to NATO unofficially. If/when Putin is ever ready to negotiate with Ukraine/NATO it would probably come through Orban. Also, Orban's conservative gov't is fighting a tidal wave of foreign influence in the form of US dollars (nicknamed "rolling dollars") that are coming from US State, CIA?, and many NGO's like Soros' Open Society that are financing the leftist opposition parties in Hungary. Many of the "dictatorial" moved made by Orban are attempts to keep this foreign influence from toppling him. Hungary is a tiny country and a few million $$$ going to a political candidate is identical to Soros buying DA's in the States where a Republican candidate may have 50K budget to campaign while 1 million from Soros to the leftist candidate is impossible to fight. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By ITCHY-FINGER: Originally Posted By Saltwater-Hillbilly: Orban is trying to play both sides; he is the guy who is holding a pair of twos and is raising as much as possible hoping someone will fold. Turkey is playing a similar game, but with a lot more chips and the ability to fold at any time with little risk. My guess is that Orban is gambling on three factors coming into play: 1) That Russia will come out of this overwhelmingly victorious in some way, and 2) Putin will remain in power and be willing to reward Hungary for it's pro-Russian neutrality, and that 3) the rest of NATO/EU would be willing to trust Hungary as an "honest broker" in the aftermath of a Russian Victory. I'm sure a combination of both corruption and compromise on the part of Orban is a factor as well. Orban's goal seems to be to set himself up as Hungary's leader in a "soft" dictatorship (along the lines of Turkey or Russia) and become a power broker between Russia and the EU in the same fashion as Turkey is in NATO. I highly doubt that Orban or Hungary can pull Orban's vision off, and the blowback for Hungary of a Russian victory would be generally bad on all fronts, but semi-dictatorial would-be dictators tend to be less than perceptive when it comes to accurately predicting 2nd- and 3rd-order effects. Excellent analysis. My one point of disagreement is that I dont think Orban wants to be a dictator or power broker. I think he is stuck in that Putin's plan did not work out but Orban cannot back out now since Putin may reveal details of certain promises made between them. Putin also needs Orban to preach Putin's aspirations and warnings to NATO unofficially. If/when Putin is ever ready to negotiate with Ukraine/NATO it would probably come through Orban. Also, Orban's conservative gov't is fighting a tidal wave of foreign influence in the form of US dollars (nicknamed "rolling dollars") that are coming from US State, CIA?, and many NGO's like Soros' Open Society that are financing the leftist opposition parties in Hungary. Many of the "dictatorial" moved made by Orban are attempts to keep this foreign influence from toppling him. Hungary is a tiny country and a few million $$$ going to a political candidate is identical to Soros buying DA's in the States where a Republican candidate may have 50K budget to campaign while 1 million from Soros to the leftist candidate is impossible to fight. I've done enough research and conclusions that Orban is gambling for the loan forgiveness on the PAKS II. Even today it is a zero interest 25 year loan, canceling the loan as a reward is something pretty powerful of a drug. It's fucked up I know....can easily be remedied by the west. But it is a west that simply refuses to stop the migrant tidalwave and cocksucking of 3rd world shitholers like they are holier than gold. |
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NV, USA
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Posted: 12/6/2023 5:59:53 AM EST
[#15]
Candid assessment of French policy, but really its the whole of Europe and current admin:
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NV, USA
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Posted: 12/6/2023 6:32:17 AM EST
[Last Edit: spydercomonkey]
[#16]
The Will
Russian oil price cap has largely failed, new report finds An analysis shared with POLITICO reveals that sanctions cheats, gaping loopholes and widespread circumvention mean oil revenues are still filling Moscow’s war chest. https://www.politico.eu/article/russia-oil-price-cap-ukraine-war-centre-research-energy-clean-air/ It’s not that the price limit has had no effect. Over the last year, the scheme has cost the Kremlin €34 billion in export revenues, the equivalent of around two months of earnings this year, according to the new analysis from the Centre for Research on Energy and Clean Air (CREA) think tank shared with POLITICO. But that's far less than those who designed the rules had hoped; moreover, the impact was felt most intensely in the first half of 2023 before beginning to fade. Russian oil now consistently sells for more than the $60 limit. "The impact of the price cap has been limited due to inadequate monitoring and enforcement," said Isaac Levi, who leads CREA's work on Europe and Russia, with Western nations failing to crack down on sanctions loopholes. The shortfall is partly due to traders simply ignoring the price ceiling, the report states, and Russian oil is selling for roughly $70 a barrel. Around 48 percent of Russian oil cargoes were carried on tankers owned or insured in G7 and EU countries, the researchers found; in theory, the price cap should apply to these vessels, which comprise the vast majority of the global fleet — but in practice, few operators have been targeted. A “refining loophole” has also undermined Western efforts. Countries like India are buying huge volumes of Russian crude on the cheap, processing it and then selling it to anyone who wants it, without restrictions. That means European consumers could unknowingly be using petrol, diesel and jet fuel produced from Russian crude, bankrolling Moscow's armed forces at the same time. Only a handful of individuals have been charged by Western governments for failing to adhere to the rules, and investigations into alleged wrongdoing are rare. Meanwhile, Russia has openly flouted the ban, while a shadow fleet of aging tankers contrives to obscure the true origin of its supplies. Changing the rules to ban these practices, and ensuring that sanctions violations draw consequences, would make it harder for the Kremlin to pay for the weapons and military salaries that sustain the conflict in Ukraine, the report states. "The sanctions have not reduced the Kremlin’s resolve for war." "At current prices, and even if Russia earns these $60 dollars in the price cap … this will not affect revenue enough to force any change of strategy or to limit Russia's resources enough to make a difference on the battlefield," he said. |
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Posted: 12/6/2023 6:44:22 AM EST
[#17]
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Posted: 12/6/2023 7:04:29 AM EST
[#18]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By meistermash: A 1000 gallon propane cylinder with a bearing on the ends and filled with water. An uparmored d11 carrying a full blade of dirt. They can now be ran autonomously (remote control) these days. D11's likely cost as much as a couple of shitty Russian tanks though. There were those tree muncher forest clearers they used in South America. They had big assed steel wheels. The solution IS out there somewhere...Caterpillar or whoever makes those ginormous earth movers should donate a couple for experimentation. Maybe the time of the "land-battleship" has finally arrived. |
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Posted: 12/6/2023 7:09:50 AM EST
[#19]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Saltwater-Hillbilly: I don't disagree with any of your assessment, other than the fact that Orban's policy of governing under a "COVID" state of emergency recalls the worst excesses of our own government, as well as others throughout history. I agree also that Hungary (along with a lot of other countries in the EU) are justifiably tired of being manipulated by a bunch of overeducated ideologically-driven halfwits surfing through life on their credentials with either more money than sense and/or delusions of grandeur while displaying inadequacy and incompetence in equal measures. I also agree that Orban is in many ways looking out for Hungary's interests. However, his biggest flaws are failing to see the forest for the trees when it comes to Ukraine and Russia, as well as the obvious strategic threat to Hungary if Russia is successful. Orban would have a lot more credibility if his government stood up to Russia and called them out with the same zeal he calls out the EU and NATO; but at this point he is probably far too compromised to even consider it. I agree with everything here 100%. Orban's total embrace of the covid lockdowns rivalled New Zealand and others. I think it proves that people, especially people who seek gov't office have an innate authoritarian inside just waiting to bust out at the right time. All future elections should highlight every candidates covid response. The 2020 template will be followed and repeated in the future. |
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WY, USA
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Posted: 12/6/2023 7:38:01 AM EST
[#20]
Quote HistoryHOLY SHIT! You look at the canopy of the truck I didn't realize the volume and concentration those balls had. It's amazing some of them were able to move a couple steps out of the truck before blood pressure loss. That is insanely destructive and idk how anyone could of survived that. Another thought they were all on the trucks ready to move. The timing was perfect but likely by accident. No way you can have a target, communicate that, launch, in air travel time and strike with the perfect timing of all the dudes in the truck and it hasn't left yet. |
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USA
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Posted: 12/6/2023 7:50:35 AM EST
[#21]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By GunGuyMP: HOLY SHIT! You look at the canopy of the truck I didn't realize the volume and concentration those balls had. It's amazing some of them were able to move a couple steps out of the truck before blood pressure loss. That is insanely destructive and idk how anyone could of survived that. Another thought they were all on the trucks ready to move. The timing was perfect but likely by accident. No way you can have a target, communicate that, launch, in air travel time and strike with the perfect timing of all the dudes in the truck and it hasn't left yet. Yea, seeing how much light is coming through the canopy is sobering. Glad HIMARS is on our side, lol. Could have been a known rally point, either from a drone or a local tip. They might have just waited for them all to load up and concentrate near the trucks before striking. |
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Posted: 12/6/2023 7:59:15 AM EST
[#22]
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Posted: 12/6/2023 8:10:37 AM EST
[#23]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By 4xGM300m:
Very interesting. I think they will shit once they try out the Abrams! |
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Posted: 12/6/2023 8:13:04 AM EST
[#24]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By scrybe: Yea, seeing how much light is coming through the canopy is sobering. Glad HIMARS is on our side, lol. Could have been a known rally point, either from a drone or a local tip. They might have just waited for them all to load up and concentrate near the trucks before striking. Yeah, those guys were moving out for an assault. They dont get "taped up" except when expecting to storm UA trenches/positions. |
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Posted: 12/6/2023 8:29:09 AM EST
[#25]
    
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Posted: 12/6/2023 8:35:57 AM EST
[#26]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Ryan_Scott: Why would they bother looking? No one ever survives PATRIOT hitting their aircraft. Never. The Russians haven't quite figured that out just yet.  |
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Posted: 12/6/2023 8:37:43 AM EST
[#27]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By spydercomonkey: [b]Insight: Inside South Korea's race to become one of the world’s biggest arms dealers https://www.reuters.com/business/aerospace-defense/inside-south-koreas-race-become-one-worlds-biggest-arms-dealers-2023-05-29/ SEOUL, May 29 (Reuters) - South Korea is using a $13.7 billion arms deal with Poland - Seoul's biggest ever - to lay the groundwork for a military-industrial juggernaut that the two nations' defence companies hope will feed Europe's hunger for weapons far into the future. South Korea's arms sales jumped to more than $17 billion in 2022 from $7.25 billion the year before, according to its defence ministry, as Western countries scrambled to arm Ukraine and tensions rose in other hot spots such as North Korea and the South China Sea. South Korean and Polish officials say their partnership will help them conquer the European arms market even beyond the Ukraine war, with Seoul providing high-quality weapons faster than other countries and Poland offering manufacturing capacity and a sales pipeline into Europe. ... Hanwha Aerospace already had a 55% share of the global howitzer market - a number that will rise to an estimated 68% with the Poland deal, according to research by NH Research & Securities. At a Hanwha Aerospace factory on South Korea's southern coast, six huge automated robots and more than 150 production workers are churning out 47-ton K9s destined for Poland. The self-propelled guns use NATO-standard 155mm ammunition, have computerised fire-control systems, are designed to easily integrate into command and control networks, and offer performance comparable to more expensive Western options. Major powers such as Australia and India operate them. To meet demand, the company expects to add about 50 more workers and more production lines, production manager Cha Yong-su said during a recent tour. The robots handle about 70% of the welding work on a K9 and are key to expanding capacity, he said. They operate an average of eight hours per day but can work around the clock if needed. "Basically, we can meet any amount of order you want," Cha said. South Korea’s offer to provide weapons faster than almost anyone was a key consideration, Polish officials say. The first shipment of 10 K2s and 24 K9s arrived in Poland in December, just months after the deals were signed, and at least five more tanks and 12 additional howitzers have been delivered since. By contrast, Germany, another major arms manufacturer, has yet to deliver any of the 44 new Leopard tanks Hungary ordered in 2018, said Oskar Pietrewicz, senior analyst at the Polish Institute of International Affairs. "Countries' interest in South Korea's offer may only grow considering the limited production capacity of Germany's defence industry, which is a major arms supplier in the region," he said. A close relationship between South Korea's military and its arms industry allows them to rearrange domestic orders to make room for export production and expand production in the country's highly industrialized manufacturing base, officials said. "They put things together in weeks or months that would take us years," a European defence industry executive said, speaking on condition of anonymity because of the sensitivity of the matter. Constant tensions with North Korea mean the South's military production lines are running and its weapons have been developed, tested, and upgraded in high-pressure situations, said Cho Woorae, global business and strategy vice president at Korea Aerospace Industries. In the past year, South Korea has launched its first home-grown space rocket, saw the maiden flight of its domestically designed KFX fighter, and announced billions of dollars in deals. "For most other countries, that would be an agenda for a decade," one executive at a European defence firm told Reuters, speaking anonymously because of the sensitivity of the matter. "We’ve underestimated Korea for a long time."[/b] https://thediplomat.com/2023/07/is-south-korea-ready-to-be-a-global-pivotal-arms-exporter/ SK's goal is to be the #4 global weapons exporter by 2027. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By spydercomonkey: Originally Posted By fadedsun: Originally Posted By AlmightyTallest:
When I say that the South Koreans have come from a top ten military industrial complex to a top 5 or even 3 I wasn't making it on blind assumptions. They've made huge sales recently with Poland, too. [b]Insight: Inside South Korea's race to become one of the world’s biggest arms dealers https://www.reuters.com/business/aerospace-defense/inside-south-koreas-race-become-one-worlds-biggest-arms-dealers-2023-05-29/ SEOUL, May 29 (Reuters) - South Korea is using a $13.7 billion arms deal with Poland - Seoul's biggest ever - to lay the groundwork for a military-industrial juggernaut that the two nations' defence companies hope will feed Europe's hunger for weapons far into the future. South Korea's arms sales jumped to more than $17 billion in 2022 from $7.25 billion the year before, according to its defence ministry, as Western countries scrambled to arm Ukraine and tensions rose in other hot spots such as North Korea and the South China Sea. South Korean and Polish officials say their partnership will help them conquer the European arms market even beyond the Ukraine war, with Seoul providing high-quality weapons faster than other countries and Poland offering manufacturing capacity and a sales pipeline into Europe. ... Hanwha Aerospace already had a 55% share of the global howitzer market - a number that will rise to an estimated 68% with the Poland deal, according to research by NH Research & Securities. At a Hanwha Aerospace factory on South Korea's southern coast, six huge automated robots and more than 150 production workers are churning out 47-ton K9s destined for Poland. The self-propelled guns use NATO-standard 155mm ammunition, have computerised fire-control systems, are designed to easily integrate into command and control networks, and offer performance comparable to more expensive Western options. Major powers such as Australia and India operate them. To meet demand, the company expects to add about 50 more workers and more production lines, production manager Cha Yong-su said during a recent tour. The robots handle about 70% of the welding work on a K9 and are key to expanding capacity, he said. They operate an average of eight hours per day but can work around the clock if needed. "Basically, we can meet any amount of order you want," Cha said. South Korea’s offer to provide weapons faster than almost anyone was a key consideration, Polish officials say. The first shipment of 10 K2s and 24 K9s arrived in Poland in December, just months after the deals were signed, and at least five more tanks and 12 additional howitzers have been delivered since. By contrast, Germany, another major arms manufacturer, has yet to deliver any of the 44 new Leopard tanks Hungary ordered in 2018, said Oskar Pietrewicz, senior analyst at the Polish Institute of International Affairs. "Countries' interest in South Korea's offer may only grow considering the limited production capacity of Germany's defence industry, which is a major arms supplier in the region," he said. A close relationship between South Korea's military and its arms industry allows them to rearrange domestic orders to make room for export production and expand production in the country's highly industrialized manufacturing base, officials said. "They put things together in weeks or months that would take us years," a European defence industry executive said, speaking on condition of anonymity because of the sensitivity of the matter. Constant tensions with North Korea mean the South's military production lines are running and its weapons have been developed, tested, and upgraded in high-pressure situations, said Cho Woorae, global business and strategy vice president at Korea Aerospace Industries. In the past year, South Korea has launched its first home-grown space rocket, saw the maiden flight of its domestically designed KFX fighter, and announced billions of dollars in deals. "For most other countries, that would be an agenda for a decade," one executive at a European defence firm told Reuters, speaking anonymously because of the sensitivity of the matter. "We’ve underestimated Korea for a long time."[/b] https://thediplomat.com/2023/07/is-south-korea-ready-to-be-a-global-pivotal-arms-exporter/ SK's goal is to be the #4 global weapons exporter by 2027. Wherever one country slacks off, it only opens an opportunity for another to take advantage. 
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Posted: 12/6/2023 8:46:50 AM EST
[#28]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By ITCHY-FINGER: WOW! GAW DANG. That's brutal. Happened in Stepove. |
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Posted: 12/6/2023 8:54:42 AM EST
[#29]
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Posted: 12/6/2023 9:01:32 AM EST
[Last Edit: AlmightyTallest]
[#30]
 
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Posted: 12/6/2023 9:02:50 AM EST
[#31]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By 4xGM300m: I wonder if Germany will get back the second system in Spring 2024. Get Ukraine the second system or get their system back? |
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Posted: 12/6/2023 9:02:55 AM EST
[#32]
#Summary for the morning of December 6, 2023
▪️Another night in Ukraine took place against the backdrop of Geranium attacks on the rear regions. Explosions were heard in Odessa, Kirovograd, Zhytomyr, Kharkov, and Khmelnytsky regions. The Russian Armed Forces used missiles to hit a target in the Dnepropetrovsk region. ▪️In the Kherson direction, the Armed Forces of Ukraine are still trying to organize the evacuation of the wounded: groups arrive at points known to the Russian Armed Forces and, without waiting for the arrival of all the crippled brothers-in-arms, they take away those they could manage. 4 boats of the Ukrainian Armed Forces and 17 enemy personnel were destroyed, pressure continues on the enemy force grouping: more than 100 FAB with UMPC were dropped on enemy positions on both banks of the Dnieper within 24 hours. ▪️On the Zaporozhye front, the Ukrainian Armed Forces are not changing the direction of strikes west of Rabotino: yesterday morning another attempt to break through the enemy was stopped. By evening, near Verbovoy they reported a counterattack by our troops to a depth of 1 km, and enemy strongholds were occupied. Our aviation and long-range artillery are working. ▪️In the Vremevsky direction, the Russian Armed Forces are conducting active operations near Staromayorsky, reporting an increase in the efforts of our units near Ugledar. ▪️Avdeevsky direction without changing the passage of the LBS, data is received on the concentration of aviation and artillery fire on the positions of the Armed Forces of Ukraine at the coke-chemical plant. ▪️West and north of Artemovsk (Bakhmut), the Russian Armed Forces are conducting an offensive near the recently occupied Khromovy and in the area of dachas. The task is to take the enemy's Chasov Yar-Konstantinovka route under fire control to complicate the supply of the enemy group. ▪️In the Kupyansky direction they report stable control of the Russian Armed Forces over part of the village. Sinkovka, the battles are taking place at extremely short distances. ▪️By nightfall they reported the downing of our Su-24 in the area of Zmeiny Island in the Black Sea. The enemy continues shelling the Belgorod region and UAV raids on the region. In Gorlovka (DPR), a civilian died from Nazi shelling. The summary was compiled by: Two majors https://t.me/dva_majors/30288 ⚡️Front-line report for the morning 12/06/2023⚡️ There are no significant changes in the Kherson-Crimean direction. Ukrainian troops attack in the forest belt near Krynki. No success. Long-range weapons of the RF Armed Forces operated in the Armed Forces of Ukraine in Novodmitrovka, Dneprovsky, Kherson, Inzhenerny, Antonovka, Prydneprovsky, Ponyatovka, Tyaginka and Lvov. Ukrainian troops attacked Dzhankoy. Under fire from the Russian Armed Forces in Gola Pristan, Alyoshki, Poima, Peschanivka, Podstepnoye, Cossack Camps and Dnepryany. (Fig. 1) In the Zaporozhye direction, the Ukrainian Armed Forces, with the support of artillery, tried to advance west of the village of Rabotino. Encounter battles of a tactical nature west of Novofedorovka. Under attack by the Ukrainian Armed Forces in the settlements of Kamenskoye, Lobkovoe, Rabotino and Malaya Tokmachka. RF Armed Forces - in Zherebyanki, Nesteryanka, Kopany, Ilchenkovo, Novoprokopovka, Verbovoy, Novofedorovka and Novopokrovka. (Fig. 2) On the Donetsk Front, the Russian Armed Forces, after shelling, managed to advance into the industrial zone on the southeastern approaches to Avdeevka, east of the city and at the coke plant to the northeast. On a tactical level. Similar actions near Stepnoye (not to be confused with the settlements of the same name in the Zaporozhye and Ugledarsky directions) did not lead to a significant change in the LBS. The positions of the Ukrainian Armed Forces are under attack in Novomikhailovka, Pobeda, Georgievka, the city of Krasnogorovka, Pervomaisky, Netailovo, Ocheretin and New York. Russian ones - in Staromikhailovka, Donetsk, Vodyanoy, Kamenka, the village of Krasnogorovka and Gorlovka. (Fig. 3) https://t.me/wargonzo/16860 ✍️⚡️The situation in the Kherson direction on December 6 - analysis from @Multi_XAM and @z_arhiv Unlike areas where the Russian Armed Forces have qualitatively reversed the dynamics of the front (such as in Marinka), the situation in the Kherson direction still remains difficult. By attempting to connect three bridgeheads - in the area of Dach and Antonovsky Bridge, Cossack Camps and Krynki - the enemy is trying to divert our forces from the implementation of his main operational plan in this direction - cutting or taking under fire control the Skadovsk - Golaya Pristan highway, which is the only transport artery connecting south of the Kherson region with the Dnieper region. The right bank of the Kherson region and Kherson itself are at a height - on average up to 50-54 meters, which excludes the possibility of a frontal assault by crossing the Dnieper. Realizing this, in the summer, at the height of the fighting in the Zaporozhye direction, the command of the 9th Army Corps of the Ukrainian Armed Forces carried out an operation to misinform our troops regarding plans for an offensive here. The enemy created the appearance of preparing it by concentrating false forces to overcome the shallowed (as a result of the explosion of the Kakhovskaya hydroelectric power station) Dnieper. On the right bank, the enemy has concentrated artillery, mobile groups of UAVs, which periodically go on missions to the area of the islands, as well as reconnaissance and special forces units. In the Dach area we see the defense forces: the 194th separate battalion of the 124th brigade. Cossack Camps are the area of responsibility of the Shaman battalion of the Main Intelligence Directorate of the MOU, the 187th separate battalion of the 123rd separate TrO brigade, the 126th battalion of the 221st TrO brigade. In the Krynok area, despite the control of a relatively small area of the population, a larger number of units are concentrated: the 13th separate battalion of the NSU, the 36th marine brigade, the 126th battalion of the 245th TrO brigade, units of the 35th and 38th marine brigades, as well as the 164th separate radio engineering brigade. The command of the Ukrainian Armed Forces does not intend to bring large forces into battle here, so it is being consolidated in small groups. The fact of the presence here of forces of incomparable numbers allows the enemy to hold a large group of the Russian Armed Forces in the Oleshkovsky Sands area. The forest zone, islands and coastline of the Konka River are tightly controlled by the enemy. However, in recent days, the artillery of the Russian Armed Forces has been working closely in this area, as our “colleagues in the shop” regularly report on the Khersonsky Vestnik channel. The main threat of possible offensive actions comes from the Ochakov direction. If this sector is activated, the enemy, with a high degree of probability, will launch diversionary strikes from Ochakov in the area of the Kinburn Spit, Pokrovsky, Dneprovsky, Heroysky with the aim of pinning down our forces concentrated in the southwestern part of the Kherson region. According to our data, for an effective attack, the enemy will need a landing force of high-speed boats, up to a battalion in size. Plans to conduct offensive maneuvers here are indicated by the enemy's constant reconnaissance of the coastal strip. As a rule, such actions are performed at night. And advancement into the depths of our territory is carried out in conditions of intensive aerial reconnaissance with the use of UAVs and attacks by loitering ammunition on our forces. The enemy’s high activity here is facilitated by the presence of a widely branched network of informants who transmit information about the Russian Armed Forces to the SBU and the Main Intelligence Directorate of the Ministry of Defense. In conditions of diversionary maneuvers, nevertheless, the main area for a possible landing of the DRG and assault groups of the Main Intelligence Directorate of the MOU and the operational center of the MTR "South" could become the Tendrovskaya Spit, as well as the islands northwest of the Kinburn Spit for a subsequent strike in the area of the Heroiskoye-Zabarino highway. https://t.me/multi_XAM/1037 https://t.me/z_arhiv/25585 Peskov: The Kremlin is ready for negotiations with Ukraine “Vladimir Putin has repeatedly said that the main thing for us is to achieve our goals. And, of course, we would prefer to do this primarily through political and diplomatic means,” explained the press secretary of the President of the Russian Federation on the RTVI television channel. At the same time, he recalled that Kiev recognized the fact that “they themselves abandoned the negotiations at the behest of Great Britain.” Peskov did not say anything new; Putin announced his readiness for negotiations at the recent G20 online summit. ZHIVOVZ https://t.me/zhivoff/11948 |
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Posted: 12/6/2023 9:03:01 AM EST
[#33]
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Posted: 12/6/2023 9:07:53 AM EST
[Last Edit: AlmightyTallest]
[#34]
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Posted: 12/6/2023 9:17:41 AM EST
[#35]
Quote HistoryThe amount of holes in those truck canopies is just incredible |
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Posted: 12/6/2023 9:17:45 AM EST
[Last Edit: AlmightyTallest]
[#36]
Not the best written article, but some insights on how bad Russian air defense systems are, from Russian source that tested the units against drones.
https://www.forbes.com/sites/davidhambling/2023/12/06/russian-report-explains-why-air-defenses-cannot-shoot-down-drones/?sh=6516ae237a50 “The results of field tests showed that the target detection radar of the Tor air defense system provides detection of small UAVs at ranges of only 3-4 km,” writes Makarenko. This explains why drones are able to get so close and take video of these systems: the Russians are unable to spot a drone unless it is practically on top of them. When the drones are spotted, Makarenko says Tor has trouble shooting them down. “The practical experience of experimental firing at small targets [with Tor] … indicates the low efficiency of their destruction. The main reasons for this are the imperfection of the SAM warhead detonation control system, as well as large errors in target tracking and SAM guidance on small-sized UAVs.“ This has been borne out in Ukraine, for example by this video of a Tor missile hurtling past a Ukrainian quadcopter without exploding. This is exactly what Makarenko means by a failure of detonation control. The Pantsir has a similar problem. “The results of field tests of the Pantsir-S1 air defense missile systems show that firing missile weapons at small-sized UAVs is practically impossible.” (My emphasis) Makaranko says that the detection range is close to the minimum range for the missiles: by the time Pantsir detects a drone, it is already too close to hir. Exactly the same applies to the Tunguska. “The results of assessing the possibility of firing the Tunguska anti-aircraft missile system at a mini-UAV show that firing missiles at this type of target is practically impossible,” (my emphasis) says Makarenko. Both Pantsir and Tunguska have backups though, in the form of twin rapid-fire cannon which ought to be able to annihilate small drones with ease. If only they could hit them. “The use of cannon armament of these 3PKs against small-sized UAVs is fundamentally possible, but due to the small size of the UAVs, the probability of their defeat is low,” says Makarenko. In a test in 2020, a battery of four Pantsirs opened fire on a slow-moving drone, but failed to destroy it with multiple salvoes. Again, Tunguska has the same problem. It needs a ton of ammo to have any chance of hitting. And that is not an exaggeration. “When firing at a mini-UAV of the Akila type with cannon weapons at a distance of 3 km, in order to achieve a value of the conditional probability of hitting a target equal to 0.5, it is necessary to expend from 4 to 13 thousand shells,” says Makarenko. The Tunguska fires an impressive five thousand rounds per minute from its two cannon, but only carries 1,904 rounds in total. The above calculation suggests that a drone would have to hover within range for long enough for the defenders to empty their guns, reload, then empty them again just to have a 50% chance of a hit. In fact, that's not just a ton of ammo, it's something over three tons. This may be why we see a video apparently showing a Pantsir crew baling out of their vehicle before it gets hits by an incoming FPV drone they were unable to stop. Heat seeking missiles lije those fired by Strela do not work well either, because they are designed to home in on the hot exhaust of a jet engine. Small drones simply do not emit enough infra-red to show up against the background of the sky. “Target acquisition via the IR channel is generally impossible due to its extremely weak thermal radiation,” (my emphasis) says Makarenko. He notes that in the cases where it is possible – bigger drones with liquid-fueled engines which generate more heat – the missiles can usually only lock on when the drone is flying away. He adds that most Russian surface-to-air heat-seeking missiles are fitted with impact fuses. These work well with big targets like aircraft, but unless the missile scores a direct hit on a small drone they just fly right past. Some missile now have proximity fuses, but even then Makarenko notes that the performance is not great against small drones. To destroy an aircraft, a small number of large pieces of shrapnel is best, but these may miss a small drone altogether. What they need is a warhead which throws out a dense cloud of smaller fragments and which does not yet exist. In a historical section Makarenko details the results of encounters between Russian air defense systems and drones in Libya, Syria and Nagorno-Karabakh, none of which worked out well for the defenders, and traces the problems back to the type of technical issue described above. Looking ahead, he becomes even gloomier when looking at how existing systems are highly vulnerable to attacks by multiple drones coming from different directions. “The number of simultaneously fired targets is limited to 3 for the Pantsir-S2 air defense missile system and 4 for the Tor-M2 air defense system. In this case, the targets being fired at the same time must be in the viewing area of the guidance radar. As a result, it is impossible to simultaneously work on targets attacking from different directions.” (My emphasis) The proliferation of small, cheap drones will make the situation worse. He goes through an exercise showing which calculates that a standard air defense systems will run out of ammunition without managing to stop a swarm of 15 attacking drones. “Light and relatively cheap UAVs can paralyze any air defense,” says Makarenko. Ukraine aims to acquire some 200,000 drones by the end of the year. Makarenko has many suggestions for improved defence against drones. These include new types of radar combined with optical and acoustic detection system to reliably detect drones at longer ranges. He discusses radio-frequency jamming at length, likely an important technology but one which has signally failed to stop drones in Ukraine. He mentions other technologies familiar from counter-drone discussions in the West: new types of anti-drone shells with proximity fuzes, and microwaves and lasers. But these will all take some years to develop, and Russia is in the middle of an intense drone war right now. Matters are not helped by a Russian media which insists that there is no problem. "The myth that domestic air defense systems are able to cope with any challenges in the field of countering drones continues to be supported by most official experts and the media, but this is a dangerous delusion," notes a 2022 article on Russian defense site Topwar discussing Makarenko's report. It would be interesting to know if Putin’s military commanders have been brave enough to mention the problem. The problem is acute. Ukraine’s Army of Drones claimed to have destroyed 132 targets including 30 armored vehicles in one week in November. Plenty of videos suggest these numbers are fairly accurate if not understated. Many other Ukrainian drone teams operate independently of the Army of Drones. Other nations, including the U.S. which is still working on its drone defenses, should take note. The challenge of small drones will not go away, and existing air defence provides little protection. Thankfully, we aren't in the same boat as the Russians.
    
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Posted: 12/6/2023 9:19:08 AM EST
[#37]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By mac130: The amount of holes in those truck canopies is just incredible Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By mac130: The amount of holes in those truck canopies is just incredible The results are within specifications.  GMLRS Alternative Warhead Engineer & Manufacturing Development Phase Test & Evaluation |
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Posted: 12/6/2023 9:20:59 AM EST
[#38]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By SoCalExile:
Russia … go home |
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Posted: 12/6/2023 9:25:30 AM EST
[#39]
2 hrs ago.
The road is very important for all the settlements between Oleshky and Nova Kakhovka 
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Posted: 12/6/2023 9:26:37 AM EST
[#40]
What is the latest on the aid package for Ukraine? Any chance something gets passed soon?
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Posted: 12/6/2023 9:29:15 AM EST
[#41]
20 minutes ago.
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Posted: 12/6/2023 9:29:35 AM EST
[#42]
Quote HistoryGo home Ruskies! |
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Posted: 12/6/2023 9:35:08 AM EST
[#43]
Full 5 minute video.
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Posted: 12/6/2023 9:37:25 AM EST
[#44]
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Posted: 12/6/2023 9:40:35 AM EST
[#45]
 As we predicted, NATO countries are increasing the production of artillery ammunition. Against the background of the tender won on December 4 (for the amount of 142 million euros) for the supply of 155mm artillery shells to Ukraine by 2025 by the German company Rheinmetall, plans to increase production in 2024 to 700,000 artillery shells have been announced. For these purposes, factories in Germany, Spain, South Africa and Australia will be involved. Earlier, in August 2023, Rheinmetall acquired the Spanish ammunition and weapons manufacturer Expal Municipals in the interests of increasing production capacity. It is planned to carry out the order in the interests of Ukraine at the company's facilities. On December 5, 2023, Finnish Defense Minister A. Häkkänen publicly announced plans to increase its own production of shells for supplies to Ukraine, as well as to encourage other NATO countries to participate in this process. A decision on this issue is expected before December 25 this year. The production of shells will probably be organized at the NAMMO plant in Sastamala. Despite the increasing frequency of statements about the reduction of military-technical assistance to Ukraine, NATO countries, like thimble-makers, continue to deceive the audience. Any form of “ceasefire” will definitely be used by the enemy to accumulate forces. In 5 years, the collective West plans to significantly increase the production of ammunition, weapons and equipment. Two majors https://t.me/dva_majors/30324 |
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Posted: 12/6/2023 9:43:33 AM EST
[#46]
FPV attacks on Russian forces.
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Posted: 12/6/2023 9:46:48 AM EST
[#47]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Capta: I think those are 200s - zinc coffins in their outer wooden case. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Capta: Originally Posted By SoCalExile: Looks like the Russians have figured out the wunderwaffen called pallets: https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GAgMmAXWgAAJSH_?format=jpg&name=900x900
I think those are 200s - zinc coffins in their outer wooden case. I didn't look closely before. Those boxes are exactly the right size for bodies. 
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Posted: 12/6/2023 9:47:21 AM EST
[#48]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By ServusVeritatis: If it was a Patriot shoot down there is no crew. The Patriot attacks the cockpit. Please explain. CMOS |
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Posted: 12/6/2023 9:51:05 AM EST
[#49]
After the destruction by a FPV drone of a Russian TOR-m2 system (US$ 30 mln) in early November, someone asked what was next. He replied S-300/400. Today a S-350 (US$ 135 mln) was destroyed by a FPV drone. Now, he replied "helicopter" to the same question asked by the same user. Interestingly, the S-350 was destroyed yesterday after Ukrainians shot down a Russian SU-24M over the Black Sea A few months ago, an Ukranian FPV drone tried to hit a Russian helicopter without success. 
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Posted: 12/6/2023 9:53:30 AM EST
[#50]
Quote HistoryLook at the Canopy of that one truck, totally full of shrapnel holes every couple inches at the very least. Nothing can escape this. CMOS 
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