User Panel
User Panel
User Panel
|
Posted: 10/6/2015 9:43:24 PM EDT
[#1]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
This is a great idea. While the 30-30 can't replace the 300 BO in an AR SBR , the 300 BO would be a great lever gun cartridge to replace the 30-30. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Just like grampa's old 30-30. This is a great idea. While the 30-30 can't replace the 300 BO in an AR SBR , the 300 BO would be a great lever gun cartridge to replace the 30-30. the 30-30 was one of the first, if not the very first, high velocity smokeless deer cartridges on paper, it doesn't seem that great - 170 grain flat point bullet at 1900 fps but the rifle is very very light and very handy, it's a very sleek and nice-pointing little gun the reason the 30-30 is still around is because it's a perfect match for the little rifle, it kills deer dead and it doesn't jam that skinny little buttstock into your shoulder too hard over the years, they've tried to use hard-kicking rounds in those lever guns like the 307 Winchester, but it didn't catch on because nobody wants a big heavy lever gun that kicks hard on the flip side of the coin, nobody wants a downloaded 30-30 in the form of a 300 blk what possible good would come from swapping a 30-30 out of a marlin and using a 300 blk instead come on |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/6/2015 9:47:56 PM EDT
[#2]
|
|
|
|
Posted: 10/6/2015 9:51:18 PM EDT
[#3]
I have a suppressed marlin 336 in 30-30, it's awesome
|
|
|
|
Posted: 10/6/2015 9:56:10 PM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I like my 208gr amax's traveling at about 2800-2900fps... Sorry. 300blk doesn't do that. What does that ? That seems a bit much for 308 Win/7.62x51 or 30-06. I know there is a lot beyond those two. |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/6/2015 10:09:44 PM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
If he's going to offer his product, the least he could do, is do it in the correct manner. He's trying to drum up business, but vieled advertising is just that. If he's going to discuss the technical merits of the round versus shilling then there's other forums for that but it's difficult to quantify "sexy" in a tech forum. LOFL.. I cant sell. 06 was turned in and ITAR closed down.. Last year. There is NO way possible to make the quantity to sell on the corbin hydro press and make a profit.. I would need a 6-9 station transfer press and the wife would get hella mad if i got that and put it in the garage. This is more of a na na na see what i can do and you cant thread.. 
|
|
|
|
Posted: 10/6/2015 10:12:52 PM EDT
[#6]
you guys have misunderstood my posts to this thread
I don't care if fat mcnasty sells bullets, why would I? I hope he sells lots of bullets, I'm happy about it. Good for him. live long and prosper the reason you think I hate the 300 is because I don't praise it to an absurd degree when I evaluate the 300 blk, I do the same evaluation I would do for a round like 300 magnum or 243 Winchester that makes you think I'm a "hater" I like the idea of putting a big heavy subsonic bullet in a 223 case I'm surprised it took so long to appear on the market for what it is, it's great but the power level of ANY subsonic round is the same as a warmed-up pistol round, it's not even a magnum pistol power level. that's just a matter of physics where the cartridge fails is the supersonic version. it is pretty lame, it's hardly worth bothering with. The ballistics are grossly inferior to the excellent 223 rounds available any time anybody discusses the actual physical characteristics of the 300 blk, all the fanboys act like you're kicking over a little kid's puppet show out of spite |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/6/2015 10:26:25 PM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
There's a disconnect between reality and perception with this cartridge. The numbers break down the same for the effective range of both cartridges with the caveat being that F_M isn't going to gain much traction pimping "sexy" .45ACPs here in GD. I admire his entrepreneurial spirit but he should be sent packing to shill his wares in the EE. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Don't you have some dirty license plates to report, Cyborg? I don't report them those bad apples know who they are here's the big problem that I have: everyone was talking and talking about their 300 blackout, how magical it is so I looked up the actual stats for the round and I saw that it was not magical it doesn't suppress "quiet as a typewriter", it suppresses "quiet as a loud chainsaw" it doesn't penetrate to the core of the earth after circling the globe 5 times, it's ballistically equal to a 45 acp round or it can be hot-rodded to a really sucky version of a 30-30 now everyone is shaking with rage and pain How dare you interject facts and data into a Fat_McNasty GD shill thread. He's trying to sell bullets! Disputing things no one here actually said is interjecting facts now? There's a disconnect between reality and perception with this cartridge. The numbers break down the same for the effective range of both cartridges with the caveat being that F_M isn't going to gain much traction pimping "sexy" .45ACPs here in GD. I admire his entrepreneurial spirit but he should be sent packing to shill his wares in the EE. The biggest advantage to the 300BLK is that you can fired supers and subs with a simple magazine change or even staggered in the magazine for fun. |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/6/2015 10:49:28 PM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
any time anybody discusses the actual physical characteristics of the 300 blk, all the fanboys act like you're kicking over a little kid's puppet show out of spite well you are.. 
|
|
|
|
Posted: 10/6/2015 11:01:36 PM EDT
[#9]
Quote Historysteel case 300blk? |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/6/2015 11:03:06 PM EDT
[#10]
If the selling of said "Yummy bullets" was starting the fist week of December, how would one get on someone's mailing list to get notice of this availability?
|
|
|
|
Posted: 10/6/2015 11:05:55 PM EDT
[#11]
This is the thread I needed for the inspiration to build an upper with the 300 blk barrel that i bought thanks to arfcom like 2 years ago.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 10/6/2015 11:13:52 PM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I was very excited to get a 300 blk until I realized that the excellent ballistic coefficient wouldn't help anything at subsonic velocity you might as well just shoot a hot loaded 45 acp The whole conversation can be reduced to the following: The limiting factor on shooting with a suppressor is the need to keep the ammo velocity subsonic if the ammo is supersonic, it adds a good 20 db of bullet crackling sound to the shot, which defeats the point of shooting with a suppressor subsonic ammunition is limited to the speed of sound (obviously), which is somewhere around 1000 feet per second 1000 fps velocity is what you would call +P level pistol ammo velocity no matter what shape the bullet is, or no matter how heavy it is, you're still limited to a medium to heavy pistol round it's not even a magnum pistol round. a 300 blackout or 308 whiteout or 287 greenout is all the same, it's about as powerful as a nice +P 45 acp round a subsonic 300 blackout is no more magical than a 45 acp round, they are more or less ballistically equivalent a supersonic 300 blackout round is underpowered, it's inferior to the excellent 223 hunting rounds available if you wanted a suppressed hunting rifle, a better choice would be a 308 bolt gun then you could load 240 grain bullets down to 1000 fps for suppressed use and still be able to reach out 600 yards with the full power 168 grain loads This is all very important to understand. If anyone wants to do anyone of these, the 300 blackout is not the perfect round. The 300 BO's strength is doing so much. It is a speciality round that is a generalist. It is a 45 ACP and 7.62x39 in one gun. Like many here, I have a few 9mm ARs, several 5.56 ARs, and even a suppressed 308 bolt gun. I think a 14.5" 5.56 and the 20" 5.56 are great fighting guns. I have some of each. If we have a full on war in America, those are good go to guns. 45 ACP ARs and other short semi auto carbines are hard to find and high capacity non AR 45 mags are not plentiful nor cheap. A short 300 BO is better than a 45 ACP ... right now, for the time being. The availability of good 45 guns and mags are few and far between. 7.62x39 is a lot cheaper. But, unless you are an AK fan, it isn't always so great in ARs. The 9mm can't come close to the power a supersonic 300 BO can generate. In a house or around the house in the city, it is a toss up between the subsonic 9mm and 300 BO subsonic . It is easy to beat the 300 BO in cost for ammo. While the 300 BO is not perfect, it does so much... good enough. All in all, I my view, it is the best general purpose combination of round and gun in a short AR. |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/6/2015 11:18:54 PM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Ballistics Results for 300 blk BC = 0.500 Range (yards) Velocity (fps) Energy (ft.-lb.) Trajectory (in) Come UP in MOA Come UP in Mils Wind Drift (in) Wind Drift in MOA Wind Drift in Mils Muzzle 1000 511 -1.5 0 0 0 0 0 25 990 500 2.3 -8.6 -2.5 0 0 0 50 980 490 3.8 -7.2 -2.1 0 0 0 75 971 481 3.1 -3.9 -1.1 0 0 0 100 962 472 0 0 0 0 0 0 125 953 464 -5.4 4.1 1.2 0 0 0 150 944 456 -13.2 8.4 2.4 0 0 0 Ballistics Results for 45 acp BC = 0.200 Range (yards) Velocity (fps) Energy (ft.-lb.) Trajectory (in) Come UP in MOA Come UP in Mils Wind Drift (in) Wind Drift in MOA Wind Drift in Mils Muzzle 1000 511 -1.5 0 0 0 0 0 25 975 486 2.4 -9.3 -2.7 0 0 0 50 953 464 4.1 -7.8 -2.3 0 0 0 75 932 444 3.3 -4.2 -1.2 0 0 0 100 913 426 0 0 0 0 0 0 125 895 409 -5.8 4.5 1.3 0 0 0 150 878 394 -14.4 9.2 2.7 0 0 0 At 150 yards, the 45 acp bullet has 6% less velocity, 14% less energy and 1.2 inches more drop than the 300 blackout the 45 acp rises 0.3 inches higher above the line of sight at 50 yards when using a 100 yard zero at 100 yards, the 45 acp is 5% slower than the 300 blk for all practical purposes, the two rounds are equal MATH, HOW DOES IT WORK? The 300 blackout suppresses to around 135 db, same as every other subsonic pistol round The only difference between the 45 acp and 300 blk is the cost, factory ammo for the 300 is twice as expensive there's nothing wrong with the 300 blk, but endless slobbering over it really isn't justified it really doesn't do anything magic the subsonic version is just a +P pistol round and the supersonic version is like a really weak 30-30 load or a real hot 30 M1 carbine load This... except it is ... BOTH. |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/6/2015 11:29:11 PM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
If you think that looks good you should see a .308 Is your .308 Hollywood quiet and has the same energy at 150 yards as a .45 acp at point blank range? |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/6/2015 11:55:06 PM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
.300 BLK is basically an MP5SD and a Krinkov in the same package; but with AR modularity and ergos - and you can switch between the two with nothing more than a mag change. That's the glory of it. That is the way I see it. As a lightweight here with only about a dozen ARs and 4 suppressors, along with 3 dozen other guns, (again, a lightweight for AR15.com), I have made room for a suppressed 8.5" 300 BO AR. I see it as symbol of true diversity. |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/7/2015 12:09:50 AM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
the 30-30 was one of the first, if not the very first, high velocity smokeless deer cartridges on paper, it doesn't seem that great - 170 grain flat point bullet at 1900 fps but the rifle is very very light and very handy, it's a very sleek and nice-pointing little gun the reason the 30-30 is still around is because it's a perfect match for the little rifle, it kills deer dead and it doesn't jam that skinny little buttstock into your shoulder too hard over the years, they've tried to use hard-kicking rounds in those lever guns like the 307 Winchester, but it didn't catch on because nobody wants a big heavy lever gun that kicks hard on the flip side of the coin, nobody wants a downloaded 30-30 in the form of a 300 blk what possible good would come from swapping a 30-30 out of a marlin and using a 300 blk instead come on Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Just like grampa's old 30-30. This is a great idea. While the 30-30 can't replace the 300 BO in an AR SBR , the 300 BO would be a great lever gun cartridge to replace the 30-30. the 30-30 was one of the first, if not the very first, high velocity smokeless deer cartridges on paper, it doesn't seem that great - 170 grain flat point bullet at 1900 fps but the rifle is very very light and very handy, it's a very sleek and nice-pointing little gun the reason the 30-30 is still around is because it's a perfect match for the little rifle, it kills deer dead and it doesn't jam that skinny little buttstock into your shoulder too hard over the years, they've tried to use hard-kicking rounds in those lever guns like the 307 Winchester, but it didn't catch on because nobody wants a big heavy lever gun that kicks hard on the flip side of the coin, nobody wants a downloaded 30-30 in the form of a 300 blk what possible good would come from swapping a 30-30 out of a marlin and using a 300 blk instead come on Oh, Come on. How about more bullet selection for the 300 BO? How about super 150's or sub 150's in a 300 BO lever gun? People enjoy super quiet 300 BO bolt guns. I would imagine a suppressed 300 BO lever gun would be more fun. The 30-30 is fine. But, people still buy 45 colt, 44 mag, and 357 mag lever guns. I would imagine they would buy 300 BO lever guns. How about not having to stock 30-30 ammo? I bet a 125 gr lever gun bullet in a 300 BO would smoke a 7.62x39 round for deer. Ever notice the trend of people SBRing and/or suppressing 357 lever guns? An SBRed and suppressed 300 BO lever gun might be a whole lot of fun. |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/7/2015 12:11:30 AM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryThat is the weirdest 9mm subsonic or 45 ACP subsonic round I have ever seen. |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/7/2015 12:17:11 AM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
you guys have misunderstood my posts to this thread << actually I agree with a lot you say. for what it is, it's great but the power level of ANY subsonic round is the same as a warmed-up pistol round, it's not even a magnum pistol power level. a .44 Magnum can push a 340 grain bullet to 1478 fps; which means that subsonics with the same weight are doable; Rossi makes decent M92 clones that can handle this quite well since they do make a .454 Casull variant. Just that they're lever action instead of gas impingement. And I can scope an AR pistol/SBR/M4forgery much better than I can a Rossi lever action. Optics are now a 'big deal' for me. and here's my reference for the .44 Mag load level where the cartridge fails is the supersonic version. and this is why I got a .277 Wolverine since it does better in supersonic than the .300 BLK. It can push a 90 grain bullet to 2600 fps using 1680 or 1200R without too much difficulty. Which is a compromise from what the 6.8 SPC II can do but without special bolt & mags. One of the design goals for the .277 WLV was to have a 300 meter hunting round. So, just switch out the upper and ammo then I'm there. The 300 meter limit is OK since it is the max I seen varmints & deer anymore anyway. 
and here's my reference for the .277 Wolverine loads any time anybody discusses the actual physical characteristics of the 300 blk, all the fanboys act like you're kicking over a little kid's puppet show out of spite I'm not upset, just stating for me ; it is a compromise that I've accepted. IMHO, a suppressed .300BLK in a pseudo SBR is better at HD/SD than a pistol plus doesn't make the ring&little fingers on both hands go numb for a week or so like a 12GA with 00 buck does. 
It is my preference to have thirty .300BLK rounds ready to go vs. a pistol. Again, I don't know your requirements or setup which is implied to be quite nice, and would be interested in reading your suggestions for me instead of a .300 BLK for HD in another thread since I don't want to side track Fat_McNasty's welcome back thread. Fair enough? |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/7/2015 12:26:40 AM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
you guys have misunderstood my posts to this thread I don't care if fat mcnasty sells bullets, why would I? I hope he sells lots of bullets, I'm happy about it. Good for him. live long and prosper the reason you think I hate the 300 is because I don't praise it to an absurd degree when I evaluate the 300 blk, I do the same evaluation I would do for a round like 300 magnum or 243 Winchester that makes you think I'm a "hater" I like the idea of putting a big heavy subsonic bullet in a 223 case I'm surprised it took so long to appear on the market for what it is, it's great but the power level of ANY subsonic round is the same as a warmed-up pistol round, it's not even a magnum pistol power level. that's just a matter of physics where the cartridge fails is the supersonic version. it is pretty lame, it's hardly worth bothering with. The ballistics are grossly inferior to the excellent 223 rounds available any time anybody discusses the actual physical characteristics of the 300 blk, all the fanboys act like you're kicking over a little kid's puppet show out of spite That maybe true. However, all I have read says otherwise. Everything says the super 300 BO beats the 5.56 and 7.62x39 in short SBRs from 8"-12" guns. THE biggest down side I see to the 300 BO from a practical standpoint is a good optic. The ideal optic would switch between a zeroed subsonic reticle and a separate zeroed supersonic reticle. I know of no such optic, including the Leupold |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/7/2015 12:26:57 AM EDT
[#20]
Quote History |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/7/2015 12:37:53 AM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Good to hear! Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Are you sharing again? well Dec 5th is coming quickly..  This mean your health is doing better? Remember you saying that was the reason you were taking a break after making expanding subsonic 300BLK. almost one year no cancer re-occurrence, Medical bills getting paid down. and almost back to my mean old self 10 lbs heaver.  and blood pressure is way down. so ya things are looking up.Good to hear! +1 and oh yeah... this adds to the sexiness with its 300 blk reticle 
|
|
|
|
Posted: 10/7/2015 12:43:02 AM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
if the ammo is supersonic, it adds a good 20 db of bullet crackling sound to the shot, which defeats the point of shooting with a suppressor 
|
|
|
|
Posted: 10/7/2015 1:13:23 AM EDT
[#23]
I really wanted to try these.
If you don't have the 06 anymore, how about talking to Hornady, Nosler, or Sierra about production? As the 300FAT BLK Expander Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/7/2015 8:58:55 AM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Ballistics Results for 300 blk BC = 0.500 Range (yards) Velocity (fps) Energy (ft.-lb.) Trajectory (in) Come UP in MOA Come UP in Mils Wind Drift (in) Wind Drift in MOA Wind Drift in Mils Muzzle 1000 511 -1.5 0 0 0 0 0 25 990 500 2.3 -8.6 -2.5 0 0 0 50 980 490 3.8 -7.2 -2.1 0 0 0 75 971 481 3.1 -3.9 -1.1 0 0 0 100 962 472 0 0 0 0 0 0 125 953 464 -5.4 4.1 1.2 0 0 0 150 944 456 -13.2 8.4 2.4 0 0 0 Ballistics Results for 45 acp BC = 0.200 Range (yards) Velocity (fps) Energy (ft.-lb.) Trajectory (in) Come UP in MOA Come UP in Mils Wind Drift (in) Wind Drift in MOA Wind Drift in Mils Muzzle 1000 511 -1.5 0 0 0 0 0 25 975 486 2.4 -9.3 -2.7 0 0 0 50 953 464 4.1 -7.8 -2.3 0 0 0 75 932 444 3.3 -4.2 -1.2 0 0 0 100 913 426 0 0 0 0 0 0 125 895 409 -5.8 4.5 1.3 0 0 0 150 878 394 -14.4 9.2 2.7 0 0 0 At 150 yards, the 45 acp bullet has 6% less velocity, 14% less energy and 1.2 inches more drop than the 300 blackout the 45 acp rises 0.3 inches higher above the line of sight at 50 yards when using a 100 yard zero at 100 yards, the 45 acp is 5% slower than the 300 blk for all practical purposes, the two rounds are equal MATH, HOW DOES IT WORK? The 300 blackout suppresses to around 135 db, same as every other subsonic pistol round The only difference between the 45 acp and 300 blk is the cost, factory ammo for the 300 is twice as expensive there's nothing wrong with the 300 blk, but endless slobbering over it really isn't justified it really doesn't do anything magic the subsonic version is just a +P pistol round and the supersonic version is like a really weak 30-30 load or a real hot 30 M1 carbine load |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/7/2015 10:21:46 AM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
LOFL.. I cant sell. 06 was turned in and ITAR closed down.. Last year. There is NO way possible to make the quantity to sell on the corbin hydro press and make a profit.. I would need a 6-9 station transfer press and the wife would get hella mad if i got that and put it in the garage. This is more of a na na na see what i can do and you cant thread.. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
If he's going to offer his product, the least he could do, is do it in the correct manner. He's trying to drum up business, but vieled advertising is just that. If he's going to discuss the technical merits of the round versus shilling then there's other forums for that but it's difficult to quantify "sexy" in a tech forum. LOFL.. I cant sell. 06 was turned in and ITAR closed down.. Last year. There is NO way possible to make the quantity to sell on the corbin hydro press and make a profit.. I would need a 6-9 station transfer press and the wife would get hella mad if i got that and put it in the garage. This is more of a na na na see what i can do and you cant thread.. unsubscribed |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/7/2015 1:31:42 PM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
LOFL.. I cant sell. 06 was turned in and ITAR closed down.. Last year. There is NO way possible to make the quantity to sell on the corbin hydro press and make a profit.. I would need a 6-9 station transfer press and the wife would get hella mad if i got that and put it in the garage. This is more of a na na na see what i can do and you cant thread.. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
If he's going to offer his product, the least he could do, is do it in the correct manner. He's trying to drum up business, but vieled advertising is just that. If he's going to discuss the technical merits of the round versus shilling then there's other forums for that but it's difficult to quantify "sexy" in a tech forum. LOFL.. I cant sell. 06 was turned in and ITAR closed down.. Last year. There is NO way possible to make the quantity to sell on the corbin hydro press and make a profit.. I would need a 6-9 station transfer press and the wife would get hella mad if i got that and put it in the garage. This is more of a na na na see what i can do and you cant thread.. I had hopes, man. 
I'm glad to hear you are feeling better! 
|
|
|
|
Posted: 10/7/2015 1:39:10 PM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
if the ammo is supersonic, it adds a good 20 db of bullet crackling sound to the shot, which defeats the point of shooting with a suppressor http://40.media.tumblr.com/22ad286837eb11ba3fb46b6682a75817/tumblr_mkrjf4C3oL1rj8nzio1_500.png why don't you look up the decibel levels for supersonic bullets in flight it's complicated and varies but you'll see they meter out to around 140 db or so then come back to the thread and be the elite hero |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/7/2015 1:39:18 PM EDT
[#28]
psst: It's a cartridge, not a bullet.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 10/7/2015 1:43:41 PM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
LOFL.. I cant sell. 06 was turned in and ITAR closed down.. Last year. There is NO way possible to make the quantity to sell on the corbin hydro press and make a profit.. I would need a 6-9 station transfer press and the wife would get hella mad if i got that and put it in the garage. This is more of a na na na see what i can do and you cant thread.. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
If he's going to offer his product, the least he could do, is do it in the correct manner. He's trying to drum up business, but vieled advertising is just that. If he's going to discuss the technical merits of the round versus shilling then there's other forums for that but it's difficult to quantify "sexy" in a tech forum. LOFL.. I cant sell. 06 was turned in and ITAR closed down.. Last year. There is NO way possible to make the quantity to sell on the corbin hydro press and make a profit.. I would need a 6-9 station transfer press and the wife would get hella mad if i got that and put it in the garage. This is more of a na na na see what i can do and you cant thread.. I love what you do, an exercise in what can be done. GD is the biggest collection of assholes in the free world. |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/7/2015 1:48:56 PM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Again, I don't know your requirements or setup which is implied to be quite nice, and would be interested in reading your suggestions for me instead of a .300 BLK for HD in another thread since I don't want to side track Fat_McNasty's welcome back thread. Fair enough? Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
you guys have misunderstood my posts to this thread << actually I agree with a lot you say. for what it is, it's great but the power level of ANY subsonic round is the same as a warmed-up pistol round, it's not even a magnum pistol power level. a .44 Magnum can push a 340 grain bullet to 1478 fps; which means that subsonics with the same weight are doable; Rossi makes decent M92 clones that can handle this quite well since they do make a .454 Casull variant. Just that they're lever action instead of gas impingement. And I can scope an AR pistol/SBR/M4forgery much better than I can a Rossi lever action. Optics are now a 'big deal' for me. and here's my reference for the .44 Mag load level where the cartridge fails is the supersonic version. and this is why I got a .277 Wolverine since it does better in supersonic than the .300 BLK. It can push a 90 grain bullet to 2600 fps using 1680 or 1200R without too much difficulty. Which is a compromise from what the 6.8 SPC II can do but without special bolt & mags. One of the design goals for the .277 WLV was to have a 300 meter hunting round. So, just switch out the upper and ammo then I'm there. The 300 meter limit is OK since it is the max I seen varmints & deer anymore anyway.
and here's my reference for the .277 Wolverine loads any time anybody discusses the actual physical characteristics of the 300 blk, all the fanboys act like you're kicking over a little kid's puppet show out of spite I'm not upset, just stating for me ; it is a compromise that I've accepted. IMHO, a suppressed .300BLK in a pseudo SBR is better at HD/SD than a pistol plus doesn't make the ring&little fingers on both hands go numb for a week or so like a 12GA with 00 buck does.
It is my preference to have thirty .300BLK rounds ready to go vs. a pistol. Again, I don't know your requirements or setup which is implied to be quite nice, and would be interested in reading your suggestions for me instead of a .300 BLK for HD in another thread since I don't want to side track Fat_McNasty's welcome back thread. Fair enough? I think you should use a cartridge that's "typewriter quiet", meaning something around 70db that's 10 db quieter than a dial tone according to the threads i read right here on arfcom, that would be the 300 blk |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/7/2015 1:49:14 PM EDT
[#31]
How does one get their hands on some of these subs? You know, for research purposes?
|
|
|
|
Posted: 10/7/2015 1:49:41 PM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I love what you do, an exercise in what can be done. GD is the biggest collection of assholes in the free world. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
If he's going to offer his product, the least he could do, is do it in the correct manner. He's trying to drum up business, but vieled advertising is just that. If he's going to discuss the technical merits of the round versus shilling then there's other forums for that but it's difficult to quantify "sexy" in a tech forum. LOFL.. I cant sell. 06 was turned in and ITAR closed down.. Last year. There is NO way possible to make the quantity to sell on the corbin hydro press and make a profit.. I would need a 6-9 station transfer press and the wife would get hella mad if i got that and put it in the garage. This is more of a na na na see what i can do and you cant thread.. I love what you do, an exercise in what can be done. GD is the biggest collection of assholes in the free world. and here you are |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/7/2015 3:05:04 PM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I think you should use a cartridge that's "typewriter quiet", meaning something around 70db that's 10 db quieter than a dial tone according to the threads i read right here on arfcom, that would be the 300 blk Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: you guys have misunderstood my posts to this thread << actually I agree with a lot you say. for what it is, it's great but the power level of ANY subsonic round is the same as a warmed-up pistol round, it's not even a magnum pistol power level. a .44 Magnum can push a 340 grain bullet to 1478 fps; which means that subsonics with the same weight are doable; Rossi makes decent M92 clones that can handle this quite well since they do make a .454 Casull variant. Just that they're lever action instead of gas impingement. And I can scope an AR pistol/SBR/M4forgery much better than I can a Rossi lever action. Optics are now a 'big deal' for me. and here's my reference for the .44 Mag load level where the cartridge fails is the supersonic version. and this is why I got a .277 Wolverine since it does better in supersonic than the .300 BLK. It can push a 90 grain bullet to 2600 fps using 1680 or 1200R without too much difficulty. Which is a compromise from what the 6.8 SPC II can do but without special bolt & mags. One of the design goals for the .277 WLV was to have a 300 meter hunting round. So, just switch out the upper and ammo then I'm there. The 300 meter limit is OK since it is the max I seen varmints & deer anymore anyway. and here's my reference for the .277 Wolverine loads any time anybody discusses the actual physical characteristics of the 300 blk, all the fanboys act like you're kicking over a little kid's puppet show out of spite I'm not upset, just stating for me ; it is a compromise that I've accepted. IMHO, a suppressed .300BLK in a pseudo SBR is better at HD/SD than a pistol plus doesn't make the ring&little fingers on both hands go numb for a week or so like a 12GA with 00 buck does. It is my preference to have thirty .300BLK rounds ready to go vs. a pistol. Again, I don't know your requirements or setup which is implied to be quite nice, and would be interested in reading your suggestions for me instead of a .300 BLK for HD in another thread since I don't want to side track Fat_McNasty's welcome back thread. Fair enough? I think you should use a cartridge that's "typewriter quiet", meaning something around 70db that's 10 db quieter than a dial tone according to the threads i read right here on arfcom, that would be the 300 blk |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/7/2015 3:38:01 PM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I had hopes, man.
I'm glad to hear you are feeling better!
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
If he's going to offer his product, the least he could do, is do it in the correct manner. He's trying to drum up business, but vieled advertising is just that. If he's going to discuss the technical merits of the round versus shilling then there's other forums for that but it's difficult to quantify "sexy" in a tech forum. LOFL.. I cant sell. 06 was turned in and ITAR closed down.. Last year. There is NO way possible to make the quantity to sell on the corbin hydro press and make a profit.. I would need a 6-9 station transfer press and the wife would get hella mad if i got that and put it in the garage. This is more of a na na na see what i can do and you cant thread.. I had hopes, man.
I'm glad to hear you are feeling better!
Welcome to the land of the free. fascist. ITAR is a fucking millstone around the necks of small business (and plenty of medium/large businesses, too) 
You can't even make cast lead projectiles for resale without being an ITAR registered manufacturer.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 10/7/2015 5:28:47 PM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
that's what im working on now.. trying to get the price down to an easy to swallow number. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
220gr of my own creation. will expand at 750 fps. How many Shekels for the boolits? that's what im working on now.. trying to get the price down to an easy to swallow number. I'd be interested in loaded cartridges. |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/11/2015 8:28:08 PM EDT
[#36]
I want some 300 blk ammo that fires .223 sabots.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 10/11/2015 8:34:27 PM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I want some 300 blk ammo that fires .223 sabots. http://eabco.com/remington-accelerator-sabots.html |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/11/2015 9:02:40 PM EDT
[#38]
Honestly, I'd like to try a .17-223
25 gr at 4000 fps. Cheap to reload Prairie dog round? |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/11/2015 9:51:31 PM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Oh, Come on. How about more bullet selection for the 300 BO? How about super 150's or sub 150's in a 300 BO lever gun? People enjoy super quiet 300 BO bolt guns. I would imagine a suppressed 300 BO lever gun would be more fun. The 30-30 is fine. But, people still buy 45 colt, 44 mag, and 357 mag lever guns. I would imagine they would buy 300 BO lever guns. How about not having to stock 30-30 ammo? I bet a 125 gr lever gun bullet in a 300 BO would smoke a 7.62x39 round for deer. Ever notice the trend of people SBRing and/or suppressing 357 lever guns? An SBRed and suppressed 300 BO lever gun might be a whole lot of fun. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: ... This is a great idea. While the 30-30 can't replace the 300 BO in an AR SBR , the 300 BO would be a great lever gun cartridge to replace the 30-30. on paper, it doesn't seem that great - 170 grain flat point bullet at 1900 fps but the rifle is very very light and very handy, it's a very sleek and nice-pointing little gun the reason the 30-30 is still around is because it's a perfect match for the little rifle, it kills deer dead and it doesn't jam that skinny little buttstock into your shoulder too hard over the years, they've tried to use hard-kicking rounds in those lever guns like the 307 Winchester, but it didn't catch on because nobody wants a big heavy lever gun that kicks hard on the flip side of the coin, nobody wants a downloaded 30-30 in the form of a 300 blk what possible good would come from swapping a 30-30 out of a marlin and using a 300 blk instead come on How about more bullet selection for the 300 BO? How about super 150's or sub 150's in a 300 BO lever gun? People enjoy super quiet 300 BO bolt guns. I would imagine a suppressed 300 BO lever gun would be more fun. The 30-30 is fine. But, people still buy 45 colt, 44 mag, and 357 mag lever guns. I would imagine they would buy 300 BO lever guns. How about not having to stock 30-30 ammo? I bet a 125 gr lever gun bullet in a 300 BO would smoke a 7.62x39 round for deer. Ever notice the trend of people SBRing and/or suppressing 357 lever guns? An SBRed and suppressed 300 BO lever gun might be a whole lot of fun. Something like this? I think it would be a hoot in 300BLK but alas, too many projects on the list and not enough funds...  Shorten the rail, normal lever-loop, thinner can, slim down the forearm, and GIMME! Video about it here.  |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/11/2015 10:02:31 PM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Ballistics Results for 300 blk BC = 0.500 Range (yards) Velocity (fps) Energy (ft.-lb.) Trajectory (in) Come UP in MOA Come UP in Mils Wind Drift (in) Wind Drift in MOA Wind Drift in Mils Muzzle 1000 511 -1.5 0 0 0 0 0 25 990 500 2.3 -8.6 -2.5 0 0 0 50 980 490 3.8 -7.2 -2.1 0 0 0 75 971 481 3.1 -3.9 -1.1 0 0 0 100 962 472 0 0 0 0 0 0 125 953 464 -5.4 4.1 1.2 0 0 0 150 944 456 -13.2 8.4 2.4 0 0 0 Ballistics Results for 45 acp BC = 0.200 Range (yards) Velocity (fps) Energy (ft.-lb.) Trajectory (in) Come UP in MOA Come UP in Mils Wind Drift (in) Wind Drift in MOA Wind Drift in Mils Muzzle 1000 511 -1.5 0 0 0 0 0 25 975 486 2.4 -9.3 -2.7 0 0 0 50 953 464 4.1 -7.8 -2.3 0 0 0 75 932 444 3.3 -4.2 -1.2 0 0 0 100 913 426 0 0 0 0 0 0 125 895 409 -5.8 4.5 1.3 0 0 0 150 878 394 -14.4 9.2 2.7 0 0 0 At 150 yards, the 45 acp bullet has 6% less velocity, 14% less energy and 1.2 inches more drop than the 300 blackout the 45 acp rises 0.3 inches higher above the line of sight at 50 yards when using a 100 yard zero at 100 yards, the 45 acp is 5% slower than the 300 blk for all practical purposes, the two rounds are equal MATH, HOW DOES IT WORK? The 300 blackout suppresses to around 135 db, same as every other subsonic pistol round The only difference between the 45 acp and 300 blk is the cost, factory ammo for the 300 is twice as expensive there's nothing wrong with the 300 blk, but endless slobbering over it really isn't justified it really doesn't do anything magic the subsonic version is just a +P pistol round and the supersonic version is like a really weak 30-30 load or a real hot 30 M1 carbine load But going from sub to supers with 300blk is a mag change. Which gives you like 3 times the energy immediately. .45 is slightly worse to the 300blk in subs and immensely worse compared to the supers. Utility is the key. |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/11/2015 10:13:58 PM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
But going from sub to supers with 300blk is a mag change. Which gives you like 3 times the energy immediately. .45 is slightly worse to the 300blk in subs and immensely worse compared to the supers. Utility is the key. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Ballistics Results for 300 blk BC = 0.500 Range (yards) Velocity (fps) Energy (ft.-lb.) Trajectory (in) Come UP in MOA Come UP in Mils Wind Drift (in) Wind Drift in MOA Wind Drift in Mils Muzzle 1000 511 -1.5 0 0 0 0 0 25 990 500 2.3 -8.6 -2.5 0 0 0 50 980 490 3.8 -7.2 -2.1 0 0 0 75 971 481 3.1 -3.9 -1.1 0 0 0 100 962 472 0 0 0 0 0 0 125 953 464 -5.4 4.1 1.2 0 0 0 150 944 456 -13.2 8.4 2.4 0 0 0 Ballistics Results for 45 acp BC = 0.200 Range (yards) Velocity (fps) Energy (ft.-lb.) Trajectory (in) Come UP in MOA Come UP in Mils Wind Drift (in) Wind Drift in MOA Wind Drift in Mils Muzzle 1000 511 -1.5 0 0 0 0 0 25 975 486 2.4 -9.3 -2.7 0 0 0 50 953 464 4.1 -7.8 -2.3 0 0 0 75 932 444 3.3 -4.2 -1.2 0 0 0 100 913 426 0 0 0 0 0 0 125 895 409 -5.8 4.5 1.3 0 0 0 150 878 394 -14.4 9.2 2.7 0 0 0 At 150 yards, the 45 acp bullet has 6% less velocity, 14% less energy and 1.2 inches more drop than the 300 blackout the 45 acp rises 0.3 inches higher above the line of sight at 50 yards when using a 100 yard zero at 100 yards, the 45 acp is 5% slower than the 300 blk for all practical purposes, the two rounds are equal MATH, HOW DOES IT WORK? The 300 blackout suppresses to around 135 db, same as every other subsonic pistol round The only difference between the 45 acp and 300 blk is the cost, factory ammo for the 300 is twice as expensive there's nothing wrong with the 300 blk, but endless slobbering over it really isn't justified it really doesn't do anything magic the subsonic version is just a +P pistol round and the supersonic version is like a really weak 30-30 load or a real hot 30 M1 carbine load But going from sub to supers with 300blk is a mag change. Which gives you like 3 times the energy immediately. .45 is slightly worse to the 300blk in subs and immensely worse compared to the supers. Utility is the key. Give up. that point is continually ignored by individuals who have an irrational hatred of the 300blk. it is not as effective to 1000yds as a 50 cal so it is completely and totally useless.
those numbers, while interesting, mean nothing to 95% of people who will shoot a 300blk. Some people can't help themselves. |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/11/2015 10:16:07 PM EDT
[#42]
amazing what marketing can do for a 30.30 WCF churched up to appeal to the fad of the year clubs |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/11/2015 11:16:16 PM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Give up. that point is continually ignored by individuals who have an irrational hatred of the 300blk. it is not as effective to 1000yds as a 50 cal so it is completely and totally useless. those numbers, while interesting, mean nothing to 95% of people who will shoot a 300blk. Some people can't help themselves. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Ballistics Results for 300 blk BC = 0.500 Range (yards) Velocity (fps) Energy (ft.-lb.) Trajectory (in) Come UP in MOA Come UP in Mils Wind Drift (in) Wind Drift in MOA Wind Drift in Mils Muzzle 1000 511 -1.5 0 0 0 0 0 25 990 500 2.3 -8.6 -2.5 0 0 0 50 980 490 3.8 -7.2 -2.1 0 0 0 75 971 481 3.1 -3.9 -1.1 0 0 0 100 962 472 0 0 0 0 0 0 125 953 464 -5.4 4.1 1.2 0 0 0 150 944 456 -13.2 8.4 2.4 0 0 0 Ballistics Results for 45 acp BC = 0.200 Range (yards) Velocity (fps) Energy (ft.-lb.) Trajectory (in) Come UP in MOA Come UP in Mils Wind Drift (in) Wind Drift in MOA Wind Drift in Mils Muzzle 1000 511 -1.5 0 0 0 0 0 25 975 486 2.4 -9.3 -2.7 0 0 0 50 953 464 4.1 -7.8 -2.3 0 0 0 75 932 444 3.3 -4.2 -1.2 0 0 0 100 913 426 0 0 0 0 0 0 125 895 409 -5.8 4.5 1.3 0 0 0 150 878 394 -14.4 9.2 2.7 0 0 0 At 150 yards, the 45 acp bullet has 6% less velocity, 14% less energy and 1.2 inches more drop than the 300 blackout the 45 acp rises 0.3 inches higher above the line of sight at 50 yards when using a 100 yard zero at 100 yards, the 45 acp is 5% slower than the 300 blk for all practical purposes, the two rounds are equal MATH, HOW DOES IT WORK? The 300 blackout suppresses to around 135 db, same as every other subsonic pistol round The only difference between the 45 acp and 300 blk is the cost, factory ammo for the 300 is twice as expensive there's nothing wrong with the 300 blk, but endless slobbering over it really isn't justified it really doesn't do anything magic the subsonic version is just a +P pistol round and the supersonic version is like a really weak 30-30 load or a real hot 30 M1 carbine load But going from sub to supers with 300blk is a mag change. Which gives you like 3 times the energy immediately. .45 is slightly worse to the 300blk in subs and immensely worse compared to the supers. Utility is the key. Give up. that point is continually ignored by individuals who have an irrational hatred of the 300blk. it is not as effective to 1000yds as a 50 cal so it is completely and totally useless. those numbers, while interesting, mean nothing to 95% of people who will shoot a 300blk. Some people can't help themselves. |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/11/2015 11:44:44 PM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
If you think that looks good you should see a .308 I like 30-06 if I'm going to reach out and touch someone.. 300 BLK if I want to stick with an AR15 but want bigger holes. 
|
|
|
|
Posted: 10/12/2015 12:02:18 AM EDT
[#45]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
In this thread we find those who neither SBR nor suppress. Nor those that can understand just how SD plays in the performance of a bullet, subsonic or otherwise. A member here that has The Wound Channel on YouTube is surprised by how a non-AP SUBSONIC 300BLK round defeats bulletproof glass while both 45 & 10mm do not, and he is not a fan of the 300. In fact, he's rather critical of it. So yeah, a subsonic round that can defeat bulletproof glass does have appeal. 300BLK subsonic bulletproof glass testing |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/12/2015 12:21:12 AM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Nor those that can understand just how SD plays in the performance of a bullet, subsonic or otherwise. A member here that has The Wound Channel on YouTube is surprised by how a non-AP SUBSONIC 300BLK round defeats bulletproof glass while both 45 & 10mm do not, and he is not a fan of the 300. In fact, he's rather critical of it. So yeah, a subsonic round that can defeat bulletproof glass does have appeal. 300BLK subsonic bulletproof glass testing Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: In this thread we find those who neither SBR nor suppress. Nor those that can understand just how SD plays in the performance of a bullet, subsonic or otherwise. A member here that has The Wound Channel on YouTube is surprised by how a non-AP SUBSONIC 300BLK round defeats bulletproof glass while both 45 & 10mm do not, and he is not a fan of the 300. In fact, he's rather critical of it. So yeah, a subsonic round that can defeat bulletproof glass does have appeal. 300BLK subsonic bulletproof glass testing Here's the exact same round (from the same box) vs a brand new piece of "bulletproof" glass, this time I knew the rating and age. It was Level IIIA (that means rated for 9mm and 44mag for those that don't know). Most people who watch that video without watching the first one don't understand why I did it, or why I was surprised it didn't go through. The first one I did just to see if the sectional density could allow such a low energy round to go through some scrap material I had laying in my shed. When it did, I figured I should repeat the test with a sample I knew more about. That way I could say it went through a Level IIIA piece of glass, not "some old plastic that came out of a gas station". Problem is, it didn't go through the glass with the actual rating. Oh well. It's not that the SD of subsonic 300blk isn't interesting, it's that I find no good application for it that I would trade a 5.56 or 6.8 SPC for. |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/12/2015 12:23:24 AM EDT
[#47]
Sectional density... Makes the 300 black out better than .45 acp
|
|
|
|
Posted: 10/12/2015 12:25:39 AM EDT
[#48]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Sectional density... Makes the 300 black out better than .45 acp |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/12/2015 12:30:13 AM EDT
[#49]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
At what? Creating ice pick wounds? Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Sectional density... Makes the 300 black out better than .45 acp You do know that there are a number of manufacturers who offer expanding subs right? |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/12/2015 12:31:45 AM EDT
[#50]
You conclude that subsonic 300 blk is worthless because it didn't penetrate IIIa bulletproof glass?
Impressidasting. |
|
|
Win a FREE Membership!
Sign up for the ARFCOM weekly newsletter and be entered to win a free ARFCOM membership. One new winner* is announced every week!
You will receive an email every Friday morning featuring the latest chatter from the hottest topics, breaking news surrounding legislation, as well as exclusive deals only available to ARFCOM email subscribers.
AR15.COM is the world's largest firearm community and is a gathering place for firearm enthusiasts of all types.
From hunters and military members, to competition shooters and general firearm enthusiasts, we welcome anyone who values and respects the way of the firearm.
Subscribe to our monthly Newsletter to receive firearm news, product discounts from your favorite Industry Partners, and more.
Copyright © 1996-2024 AR15.COM LLC. All Rights Reserved.
Any use of this content without express written consent is prohibited.
AR15.Com reserves the right to overwrite or replace any affiliate, commercial, or monetizable links, posted by users, with our own.
